Asking for evidence: attempt to prove someone wrong?
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Asking for evidence: attempt to prove someone wrong?
05-07-2017, 10:12 AM (This post was last modified: 05-07-2017 11:18 AM by BlackSwanHunter.)
Post: #1
Asking for evidence: attempt to prove someone wrong?
Seems the least common denominator here is asking for evidence, whether it's of "jurisdiction", or that a constitution applies, law applies etc

What would a Marcratic Methodist accept as sufficient evidence of jurisdiction?

can’t cite the writings: circular logic. can’t cite people in jail: some accusation of logical fallacy i can't recall, and haven't heard invoked much. can’t cite opinion: obviously.

If you can’t think of an acceptable answer, why ask? To prove someone else “wrong”?

"The things that they complain about, are things they could be changing."
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05-07-2017, 12:46 PM (This post was last modified: 05-08-2017 04:35 AM by Habenae Est Dominatus.)
Post: #2
RE: Asking for evidence: attempt to prove someone wrong?
I should have read this first:

BlackSwanHunter (aka Steven) wants to know how a person loses credibility.

Can anybody delegate an authority they don't have?
Was anybody born with innate authority over anybody else?
Then how did authority nobody had get delegated to those who call themselves government?

Show me my personally signed contract wherein I consented to be governed.
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05-07-2017, 03:27 PM
Post: #3
RE: Asking for evidence: attempt to prove someone wrong?
(05-07-2017 12:46 PM)Habenae Est Dominatus Wrote:  If there is no answer that applies at all, then there can't be an acceptable answer. If there is no evidence that the law applies, then asking the law's proponent to provide proof of the law applying will not be honored. If there is no proof the law applies, those who claim it does can't prove their claims. This then works to verify the claim that the law does NOT apply.

If you say so Confused

Seems to me to be controversial... and seems that's exactly what the so called courts are for settling...

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05-08-2017, 02:21 AM
Post: #4
RE: Asking for evidence: attempt to prove someone wrong?
(05-07-2017 12:46 PM)Habenae Est Dominatus Wrote:  Proof that the law allegedly violated applies in the first place.

If there is no answer that applies at all, then there can't be an acceptable answer. If there is no evidence that the law applies, then asking the law's proponent to provide proof of the law applying will not be honored. If there is no proof the law applies, those who claim it does can't prove their claims. This then works to verify the claim that the law does NOT apply.

For your amusement and edification:
39 year veteran attorney W. Serra and 5+ questions about authority[/color][/s][/color]

Seems you guys are convinced the evidence you're asking for doesn't exist. I agree with that part, but then, how do you arrive at the conclusion that asking for evidence over and over, and not accepting any answer is best? Guessing some will object to the wording there, but I don't listen to "the big show" much, and that's the gist of what I seem to recall. The whole point is just to try showing that the claimant is wrong?

Could asking to speak with the claimant effectively be the same as asking for evidence, if you can stay on point and not accept a "representative" and claimant as one and the same? If the claimant fails to show, there's no firsthand testimony for so called evidence, right?

"The things that they complain about, are things they could be changing."
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05-08-2017, 09:07 AM
Post: #5
RE: Asking for evidence: is NOT an attempt to prove someone wrong?
Asking for evidence to prove a claim is true is rather important. Else wise, you murdered your wife. Evidence? I don't need any evidence. I assure you, I know you murdered your wife because she's dead.

Nip it in the bud real quick. Start at the source. When a cop -- the one making the claim against you -- is giving you a traffic ticket, you could school him/her on what it means to be honorable. Such as asking for evidence the code applies to you. Lucky for you if you live to tell your friends about the criminal cop who pulled you over on a traffic stop.

When the cop turns on the flashing red and white lights to pull you over there isn't a disco ball beneath the lights. It's not party time. Those lights are a threat. If you don't pull over you'll be run off the road.

What so many individuals are up against and the worst possible consequence: http://marcstevens.net/board/thread-8854...l#pid65674

--&e

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The mafia doesn’t have a twelve year indoctrination system to convince you it’s not organized crime. ~ Brett Veinotte
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05-08-2017, 09:27 AM (This post was last modified: 05-08-2017 09:36 AM by BlackSwanHunter.)
Post: #6
RE: Asking for evidence: attempt to prove someone wrong?
(05-08-2017 09:07 AM)Andy Wrote:  Asking for evidence to prove a claim is true is rather important.

In certain circumstances, agreed.
Why would anyone ask for something they believe fails to exist? In an effort to “disprove” something? Controversy = "jurisdiction"... could it be?

(05-08-2017 09:07 AM)Andy Wrote:  When a cop -- the one making the claim against you

On behalf of whom? Ever consider asking when you can speak with the one he claims to be doing it on behalf of?

Although you guys seem to believe asking questions beats making claims, you also seem to believe claiming to be and own the name you use is for the best. Maybe someone will show how any claim is “proven”, such as “ownership”?

(05-08-2017 09:07 AM)Andy Wrote:  Those lights are a threat

Under 'your' circumstances, agreed. Wink

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05-08-2017, 09:44 AM
Post: #7
RE: Asking for evidence: attempt to prove someone wrong?
[quote "BSH"]
Although you guys seem to believe...[/quote]

There is no "we." Each person here is an individual with differing ideas and beliefs. Please address the issues and try to avoid broad generalizations.

- NonE the severely deluded Sister Sleazious .).

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05-08-2017, 09:58 AM (This post was last modified: 05-08-2017 10:01 AM by BlackSwanHunter.)
Post: #8
RE: Asking for evidence: attempt to prove someone wrong?
(05-08-2017 09:44 AM)NonEntity Wrote:  There is no "we." Each person here is an individual with differing ideas and beliefs. Please address the issues and try to avoid broad generalizations.

Ok. How and where do you guys differ on the things I've mentioned?

1. Marc Stevens seems to understand that questions beat claims, but still seems to recommend claiming to be and own the name you're using.

2. Marc Stevens seems to recommend asking for evidence of jurisdiction and/or evidence that laws/constitutions apply, even though it also seems he believes what he's asking for doesn't exist. Why would anyone ask for something they believe fails to exist? In an effort to “disprove” something? Controversy = "jurisdiction"... could it be?

3. Maybe someone will show how any claim is “proven”, such as “ownership”?

I'm asking "you guys" because I'm assuming he also believes these things, and that's why he's here... maybe that's incorrect.

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05-08-2017, 03:27 PM
Post: #9
RE: Asking for evidence: attempt to prove someone wrong?
If I did as government types do and forced strangers to give me money, would you consider me a criminal?

I don't ask the criminal who they are robbing me on behalf of. Who knows, they may not be stealing from me on behalf of anyone but themselves. Or, maybe they're robbing me on behalf of their sick child so they can buy asthma medicine for him/her. Then again, perhaps they're just doing their job for the criminal organization they belong to, for which they'd be robbing me on behalf of.

Quote:Under 'your' circumstances, agreed.


Apparently BSH sees a disco ball when a cop turns on the flashing red and whites -- it's Miller party time. Sad

--&e

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The mafia doesn’t have a twelve year indoctrination system to convince you it’s not organized crime. ~ Brett Veinotte
Government public "education"/indoctrination is child abuse.
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05-08-2017, 04:03 PM
Post: #10
RE: Asking for evidence: attempt to prove someone wrong?
(05-08-2017 03:27 PM)Andy Wrote:  If I did as government types do and forced strangers to give me money, would you consider me a criminal?

What's with you guys and this mantra? Really think it's going to improve the situation in any way, to look down on the ones considering you a "criminal"? Care to "prove" the claim that you're being forced?

(05-08-2017 03:27 PM)Andy Wrote:  I don't ask the criminal who they are robbing me on behalf of. Who knows, they may not be stealing from me on behalf of anyone but themselves. Or, maybe they're robbing me on behalf of their sick child so they can buy asthma medicine for him/her. Then again, perhaps they're just doing their job for the criminal organization they belong to, for which they'd be robbing me on behalf of.


I ask because I hear staying on point of asking to speak with the claimant, without making claims, leads to no controversy for so-called authorities to settle. Maybe one day you'll quit blaming criminal organization, and ask to speak with him, like any honorable human hearing that someone says they did "wrong"...

(05-08-2017 03:27 PM)Andy Wrote:  Apparently BSH sees a disco ball when a cop turns on the flashing red and whites -- it's Miller party time. Sad

I hear getting out of the way when emergency lights are in use is a good idea.

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05-08-2017, 09:50 PM
Post: #11
RE: Asking for evidence: attempt to prove someone wrong?
I have heard many statists agree that gov't is force. It should be simple to admit. Ben Shapiro admitted this in a way of particular note, claiming a law should only be an opinion you are willing to kill for.

BSH, is a parking ticket something you are willing to kill for?

The no state project simply suggests self defence is the only reason to kill another human via the non aggression principle. Why won't the people that claim to represent gov't be honest about this? We might be able to move forward with a meaningful discussion if this was the case.

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05-08-2017, 10:57 PM (This post was last modified: 05-08-2017 10:57 PM by Andy.)
Post: #12
RE: Asking for evidence: attempt to prove someone wrong?
(05-08-2017 04:03 PM)BlackSwanHunter Wrote:  What's with you guys and this mantra?

Do you call it a mantra because it's so potent a question, and that pisses you off?

Quote:Really think it's going to improve the situation in any way, to look down on the ones considering you a "criminal"?

Do you really think it's going to improve the situation in any way, to look up to criminals -- putting them on a pedestal?

Quote:Care to "prove" the claim that you're being forced?

Forced to do what? Pay the tax or go to jail -- be kidnapped and put in a cage.

Quote:I ask because I hear staying on point of asking to speak with the claimant, without making claims, leads to no controversy for so-called authorities to settle. Maybe one day you'll quit blaming criminal organization, and ask to speak with him, like any honorable human hearing that someone says they did "wrong"...

I already addresses that above when I wrote... "Nip it in the bud real quick. Start at the source. When a cop -- the one making the claim against you -- is giving you a traffic ticket, you could school him/her on what it means to be honorable. Such as asking for evidence the code applies to you. Lucky for you if you live to tell your friends about the criminal cop who pulled you over on a traffic stop."

--

(05-08-2017 09:50 PM)Freerangecanuck Wrote:  I have heard many statists agree that gov't is force. It should be simple to admit. Ben Shapiro admitted this in a way of particular note, claiming a law should only be an opinion you are willing to kill for.

BSH, is a parking ticket something you are willing to kill for?

The no state project simply suggests self defence is the only reason to kill another human via the non aggression principle. Why won't the people that claim to represent gov't be honest about this? We might be able to move forward with a meaningful discussion if this was the case.

Taking into account BlackSwanHunter's (aka, Steven Richards) history on the forum and the url links he has in his name, Steven Richards, on the articles comment section and the url links in his sig. line on the forum, he's convinced me he has nefarious intent -- poisoning the well, so to speak.

--&e

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The mafia doesn’t have a twelve year indoctrination system to convince you it’s not organized crime. ~ Brett Veinotte
Government public "education"/indoctrination is child abuse.
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05-09-2017, 02:50 AM (This post was last modified: 05-09-2017 04:07 AM by BlackSwanHunter.)
Post: #13
RE: Asking for evidence: attempt to prove someone wrong?
(05-08-2017 10:57 PM)Andy Wrote:  Do you call it a mantra because it's so potent a question, and that pisses you off?

I call it a mantra because you guys seem to repeat it any chance you get, as if trying to convince yourself that it's true. I'm not the one that will suffer the consequences of your claims and beliefs, so why would that piss me off? In some ways, I might even benefit from you guys continuing to make claims... so have it Big Grin

(05-08-2017 10:57 PM)Andy Wrote:  Do you really think it's going to improve the situation in any way, to look up to criminals -- putting them on a pedestal?

Why's it seem to be only one or the other with you? Ever considered that we're all equal? Brothers and sisters?

(05-08-2017 10:57 PM)Andy Wrote:  Forced to do what? Pay the tax or go to jail -- be kidnapped and put in a cage.

"Prove" you're forced to do anything? Ever consider how you came to believe in ownership? Same way you came to believe in the state and kidnapping etc?

(05-08-2017 10:57 PM)Andy Wrote:  I already addresses that above when I wrote... "Nip it in the bud real quick. Start at the source. When a cop -- the one making the claim against you

(05-08-2017 09:27 AM)BlackSwanHunter Wrote:  On behalf of whom? Ever consider asking when you can speak with the one he claims to be doing it on behalf of?

(05-08-2017 10:57 PM)Andy Wrote:  -- is giving you a traffic ticket, you could school him/her on what it means to be honorable. Such as asking for evidence the code applies to you. Lucky for you if you live to tell your friends about the criminal cop who pulled you over on a traffic stop."

LOL you think asking for evidence "the code applies to you" is "schooling" someone on what it means to be honorable? Seems you fail to understand honor.
Why bring up evidence of code applying, unless you think it applies? To try disproving a claim you believe exists? Why believe that, until you meet the claimant?

(05-08-2017 10:57 PM)Andy Wrote:  I have heard many statists agree that gov't is force. It should be simple to admit. Ben Shapiro admitted this in a way of particular note, claiming a law should only be an opinion you are willing to kill for.

BSH, is a parking ticket something you are willing to kill for?

A so-called ticket is only a piece of paper if you ask me, is it gonna testify? Seems you wish to convince someone of something, why? Can't enjoy the moment until you convince enough people to believe in the "non aggression principle"?

(05-08-2017 10:57 PM)Andy Wrote:  The no state project simply suggests self defence is the only reason to kill another human via the non aggression principle. Why won't the people that claim to represent gov't be honest about this? We might be able to move forward with a meaningful discussion if this was the case.

Why be so common as to accuse? What's meaningful about accusing, or being common?

(05-08-2017 09:58 AM)BlackSwanHunter Wrote:  1. Marc Stevens seems to understand that questions beat claims, but still seems to recommend claiming to be and own the name you're using.

2. Marc Stevens seems to recommend asking for evidence of jurisdiction and/or evidence that laws/constitutions apply, even though it also seems he believes what he's asking for doesn't exist. Why would anyone ask for something they believe does not exist? In an effort to “disprove” something? Controversy = "jurisdiction"... could it be?

3. Maybe someone will show how any claim is “proven”, such as “ownership”?

"The things that they complain about, are things they could be changing."
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05-09-2017, 05:47 AM
Post: #14
RE: Asking for evidence: attempt to prove someone wrong?
In reviewing this thread, I found BSH to be obnoxious. And I observed an obnoxious demeanor from him in his replies to my post, said obnoxiousness being the reason that I deleted the text from my post. With that said...

He may be on to something that is worth (him) exploring. He does not do well explaining his thoughts on what he means by the name.
And he most certainly needs to provide proof that this name thing works.

I got a traffic ticket back before I knew about Marcratic Method. I asked the question, who's the injured party? The lawyer in the black dress said either the county of... or the people of the county of...

Which ever one it was, I should have called to the witness stand to provide evidence of the alleged damage.

The judge was already interfering with my defense. He didn't like my questions for the cop. Questions such as Prior to the traffic stop, did you observe me violate any other citizen's rights to life, liberty, or property?

Can anybody delegate an authority they don't have?
Was anybody born with innate authority over anybody else?
Then how did authority nobody had get delegated to those who call themselves government?

Show me my personally signed contract wherein I consented to be governed.
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05-09-2017, 05:58 AM
Post: #15
RE: Asking for evidence: attempt to prove someone wrong?
(05-09-2017 05:47 AM)Habenae Est Dominatus Wrote:  He may be on to something that is worth (him) exploring. He does not do well explaining his thoughts on what he means by the name.
And he most certainly needs to provide proof that this name thing works.

What's "this name thing"? I seem to agree with you guys, focusing on "the name" gets nowhere... besides behind bars, maybe. Been there, I believe.

Name, or sound you answer to... whatever you want to call it. Thing is, why claim to be it, or own it? How might anyone "prove" either claim? Seems so-called courts are for settling claims... why make any, then?

(05-09-2017 05:47 AM)Habenae Est Dominatus Wrote:  I got a traffic ticket back before I knew about Marcratic Method. I asked the question, who's the injured party? The lawyer in the black dress said either the county of... or the people of the county of...

Which ever one it was, I should have called to the witness stand to provide evidence of the alleged damage.

Two Thumbs Up Grinning

Why even bring up evidence? "Where's he at?"

(05-09-2017 05:47 AM)Habenae Est Dominatus Wrote:  The judge was already interfering with my defense. He didn't like my questions for the cop. Questions such as Prior to the traffic stop, did you observe me violate any other citizen's rights to life, liberty, or property?

Accusing, if you ask me, will get one accused...

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